Gas Price Talk Radio

[Bubba Bob]

3.03 in rural Maryland.  $69 dollar fillup.  I need a raise!

  BH

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What do you drive?!?!

[Brian_Holiday]

3.03 in rural Maryland.  $69 dollar fillup.  I need a raise!

  BH

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What do you drive?!?!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

4wd Ext cab Chevy. 25 gallon tank. 15 MPG highway 208 mile commute round trip.

I need a Toyota, bad...

BH

[Bubba Bob]

Heh, poor Brian.

I need a Toyota, bad

Toyota?!?!

No, ya need a FORD

[Brian_Holiday]

  Toyota?!?!

No, ya need a FORD 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Trucks, yes. Frankly If I had it to do over again I would have bought a Ford truck.

As for small cars, you cant beat Japaneese cars. Toyotas and Hondas run forever. And now that they are being built here, I can justify buying one.

BH

[Vile_DR]

Heh, poor Brian.

I need a Toyota, bad

Toyota?!?!

No, ya need a FORD

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I like the new avatar....domestics (tuners) rule...lol..***feel like I am in grade school all over again..***

**Gas Prices 3.19 premuim this morning...31.06 and only a 10 gallon tank...220 miles (if i am lucky) until I am empty...

Edited October 5, 2005 by Vile_DR

[Brian_Holiday]

I like the new avatar....domestics (tuners) rule...lol..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was born too early. I like the tuners, a friend had an escort GT (remember these?) that I spent a lot of time working on. I guess I got interested when I discovered Rally. Dirt road, lots of curves, just like high school in Kentucky. Those were some fun days, except for the ocassional slide into the ditch..

BH

[Dragon]

Eventually it will seem odd to have the engine running when the car's not moving.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You guys remember the 4-6-8 engine back in the 80's? It was a disaster then, but with todays technology they might be able to make it work. Think about it, take the parts for an aluminum small block and make them in a V twin configuration 2 cylinder pairs, then just stack them up to the required horsepower. Using modern fuel injection and good clutching you would be able to get a hybrid effect without the weight. Cyl pairs you didn't need just shut off, disengage, and freewheel to a stop.

BH

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

first post here, and yes I know the quote above is old, if you will. but just so you know, GMC has had that engine in mass production on one of their line of trucks, I want to say Suburban but I know thats the Chevy version, same truck though, for the last 9 months.

here in the land of cornfields and soybeans we are currently paying $2.79 a gallon. and thats for the mid-level, regular and hi-test unleaded are higher here.

I think that thing that gripes me the most is how these idiot congress members, thought it was fitting for them to issue a "tax break" to the oil companies. if anyone needs a break from it's us, from the oil companies raping our checkbooks and wallets, I drive a 90 dodge caravan and a 94 Escort GT. guess what my main transportation is. my 18 speed bike. I live 15 minutes from the next largest town where Wal-Mart, Target, etc is, it takes me an hour to get there, but at least I'm not paying the oil companies any more then I have to.

Also if you do the figures on prices, these oil companies don't need any help in making money. I did the figuring out the other day. and what you see next may really irritate ya.

2.02 unleaded gasoline wholesale price (per gallon)

2.93 price at pump (per gallon) national Average

.91difference in price

now lets do some harder math shall we? I am using national Averages and an approximation of how many gas stations there are nationwide. (approximately 176000 as of April 2004). Now as a lot of people may or may not know, the gas at the pumps for the gas stations in a certain radius of a big city is all pumped from the same fuel storage facility. All additives are added to the Gasoline after it is pumped into the tankers, that way it mixes as the truck drives from station to station. which means all the big oil companies are profiting from the prices at the pump at one station.

so we 91 cent profit per gallon. so here we go.

overhead costs (including refining, shipping, etc. 35%

so its

.91

- 35%

.59 total profit per gallon

now we take that profit and multiply it by number of station.

176000

x.59

103840 profit per gallon nationwide

ready for the killer number?

now we multiply the profit per gallon by the day. at 5 minutes per fillup

that comes out to 288 minutes in a 24 hour period

so it would be

103840

x288

29905920

which means these oil companies are making $29,905,920 every 24 hours, now lets compound that more by making it a week of 7 days

29905920

X 7

209,341,440 for a total weekly profit

now in all seriousness, how bad are they really hurting when it comes to profit that they need to hit us with these rediculous prices? I could only dream of making $209,341,440 a week in profit.

[Bubba Bob]

I drive past a FOR SALE escort GT every week. Sooo tempting.

Oh please Efwis, we all know the oil companies are struggling to survive.

OK, so the vehicles are "built" in america. Where do the parts come from, where's the rest of the company located? There's a whole lot more than just where the car is pieced together.

Ok, so my car was made in Mexico, but id rather half the money go to mexico, and half go to the USA than half go to Korea or Japan.

Besides, the foriegns dont get better gas milage. Focus, Metro, the other base line american compacts compete just fine.

Edited October 5, 2005 by Bubba Bob

[JDoors]

... which means these oil companies are making $29,905,920 every 24 hours ...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I work at a relatively insignificant business in relatively insignificant town in the MidWest and we make one million dollars a day. That's just this one location. You state there're 176,000 gas stations? Altogether they don't make 176,000 times what we make. So are we raping our customers too?

I've never agreed with "they make too much money" as an argument. Is all that cash sitting in an ever-growing stockpile somewhere? There's no "Mr. Burns" cackling while rolling around in a big pile of cash. Profits are being spent, invested, it's all going somewhere, doing something.

BTW, where are "taxes" in your calculations? How much of the price of a gallon of gas goes to local and state governments?

[Dragon]

taxes cannot be used in this situation since there is no standard tax across the nation on Gas prices. the prices stated are all pre-tax amounts.

as for your eloquent basis of the "Mr. Burns" theory you might be more surprised at that then you think, especially when you deal with the oil cartels. here is a description of One house. now you tell me, whoi's rolling around in the dough???

Prince Alwaleed bin Talal Alsaud of Saudi Arabia has a 317-room palace in Riyadh, which reportedly cost $130 million to build. Totaling 400,000 square feet, it has a soccer field, eight elevators and more than 500 television sets. Then again, he has $23.7 billion in riches, including a longtime 3.9% stake in Citigroup

But the point I'm making, and I am getting tired of hearing how taxes are what causes it all, is that the taxation does not have as big of an influence on our prices at the pump as most think.

The average tax on one gallon of gas is 43 cents. but that can't be figured in on these calculations, because the prices stated are pre-tax.

one more thing, those figure of $29,905,920 every 24 hours is for only one gallon of gas, not for a full tank on every car in the country. if you want I can bring about the bigger pricture of what they make in one day on full tanks of gas being pumped.

[bozodog]

I'm with JDoors..... Doesn't the vendor need a profit? He's the one paying for the realestate, taxes, employees and their comp and liability insurance, EPA inspections and regulations, maintainence on the building, utilities..... etc forever. In fact he pays for the delivery of said fuel, and the last independent carriers' bill I saw to our express mail facility had a 15% fuel surcharge added. The taxes in our state go for highway maintainence and is sadly lacking without federal funds added. Ever think about how much it costs a northern state just for snow removal? Also think about the R&D and the fact our refinery facilities are overtaxed because of the "tree hugging", "the sky is falling" (but I drive an SUV) enviromentalmentalists. No business in their right mind are going to build new facilities with the EPA laws the way they are now... Even the older ones are scrambling to do the mandated updates in the time proscribed by a grandfathered law. How can they build new when the old need "billions" in updates?

Yeah, we're all hurting. And yes, it hurts the lower classes the most. But if you compare our economy to the rest of the world, our gas is really cheap. UK? About $8 USD.... Canada? About double. What say the French, Germans, Japan?????? They all drive shoeboxes. But notice the foriegn car companies are building bigger and bigger for the American market. WHY? *BECAUSE WE WANT THEM!*

Edited October 5, 2005 by bozodog

[Dragon]

most, not all, but most states allow the vendor to make 3 cents per gallon of gas sold. I used to be a station manager, so I know that is accurate. I have also talked to station owners in other states just to find out, and all of them say they make anywhere from 1 to 3 cents per gallon of gas sold

[Bubba Bob]

and all of them say they make anywhere from 1 to 3 cents per gallon of gas sold

Ive heard that.

One thing i dont get though, every now and then ill see on the news how two gas startions are in a "price war" with each other. THe prices sometimes drop as mch as 10-15 cents. HOW?

Edited October 5, 2005 by Bubba Bob

[JDoors]

Naw, don't bother breaking it down further. Oil companies are profitable. Rulers who own their countries are rich. Boo-hoo.

Your numbers: $2.93 average price without taxes plus an average of $0.43 per for tax, so the average price of a gallon of gas is $3.36? I never paid that much, let alone averaged that amount.

Anyway, the whole "they make a lot of money" point is your thang, not mine. I'm just grateful we don't pay five bucks a gallon like many others do, and I've cut back on travel to save a few bucks. If I had bought the car I really wanted but chickened out buying I'd use even less (I'm not the kind of person that cares a whole lot what others think of me but I still could not bring myself to buy what might be perceived as a "chick car").

[Dragon]

and all of them say they make anywhere from 1 to 3 cents per gallon of gas sold

Ive heard that.

One thing i dont get though, every now and then ill see on the news how two gas startions are in a "price war" with each other. THe prices sometimes drop as mch as 10-15 cents. HOW?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

they can survive the gas wars based on the other items they sell in the station. whether its by a repair shop, food, oil, etc... the real money for a convenience store isn't in the gas sales its in everything else they sell.

Think about, how many times have you gone to the local convenience store for somthing you needed at home but didn't go to a grocery store or discount store to get. for example,

glad trash bags, 24 ct at Wal-mart I 'm guessing here is like $2.50 a box

at a convenience store, and I'm not guessing here, is $3.99 for the exact box . and they pay the same price to the supllier as Wal-Mart did. Approximately $1.29

it falls under basic economics, if you have a lower price you will sell more then your competition with the higher price, in turn you make more money because you sell more product.

as for the gas price wars, which you rarely see anymore, they take the hit in the wallet for the gas price. the object is to run the competition out of business.

[Dragon]

Naw, don't bother breaking it down further. Oil companies are profitable. Rulers who own their countries are rich. Boo-hoo.

Your numbers: $2.93 average price without taxes plus an average of $0.43 per for tax, so the average price of a gallon of gas is $3.36? I never paid that much, let alone averaged that amount.

Anyway, the whole "they make a lot of money" point is your thang, not mine. I'm just grateful we don't pay five bucks a gallon like many others do, and I've cut back on travel to save a few bucks. If I had bought the car I really wanted but chickened out buying I'd use even less (I'm not the kind of person that cares a whole lot what others think of me but I still could not bring myself to buy what might be perceived as a "chick car").     

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

neither have I, but the figures I got were from a national poll started by the FTC.

[Bubba Bob]

Think about, how many times have you gone to the local convenience store for somthing you needed at home but didn't go to a grocery store or discount store to get. for example,

NEVER. As you said, WAY to expensive. Plus the cold cokes are too tempting.

I figured they take a loss on gas, but I'd never think they would take that much of a loss.

Edited October 5, 2005 by Bubba Bob

[Dragon]

they will take a loss if they do at all, remember that gas you got at the station 2 days ago, was purchased at a different price then any they got delivered today.

so lets look at this way

you have 3 30,000 gallon tanks under your pumps. you filled them 3 days ago at $2.64 a gallon, now today you get another delivery but it cost more say $2.74 a gallon, your prices jump 10 cents, now your making 13 cents a gallon on what ever gas was in your tanks before you got your tanks topped off today.

so basic math. you have say 15000 gallons left in one tank, 9000 in tank 2, 13000 in tank 3 all bought at 2.64 a gallon

37000 gallons of gas

X .13 extra profit you make on remaining gas because your price has increased 10 cents.

$4810 Gross profit before taxes and other expenses your responsible for.

[JDoors]

... glad trash bags, 24 ct at Wal-mart I 'm guessing here is like $2.50 a box ... at a convenience store, and I'm not guessing here, is $3.99 for the exact box . and they pay the same price to the supllier as Wal-Mart did. Approximately $1.29 ...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I find it highly unlikely that a convenience store pays the same wholesale prices as Wal-Mart. If I buy two dozen cases from a wholesaler while Wal-Mart buys six million cases, Wal-Mart is gonna get a better price than I am.

But that begs the question: Why can't the HUGE oil companies sell their product cheaper than the smaller outfits? Why hasn't the "economies of scale," which works so well for Wal-Mart, taken place in the oil industry? (I know, I know! Greed, right?)

[Dragon]

you got it

Greed is the biggest evil in the marketable world, everyone wants more

Oh and I forgot, they are a monopoly for the most part. there really is no competition to speak of as of yet.

[JDoors]

Well, unless you eat nuts and berries and live in a tent made of sticks and leaves you probably use money yourself, and I assume you'd like even more. So greed isn't "nasty" or evil all by itself.

mo-nop-o-ly (m-nop-le)n.pl. mo-nop-o-lies. 1. Exclusive control by one group of the means of producing or selling a commodity or service. 2. Law. A right granted by a government giving exclusive control over a specified commercial activity to a single party. 3. A company or group having exclusive control over a commercial activity. A commodity or service so controlled. 4. Exclusive possession or control: arrogantly claims to have a monopoly on the truth. Something that is exclusively possessed or controlled: showed that scientific achievement is not a male monopoly.[Latin monopolium, from Greek monopolion : mono-, mono- + polein, to sell. See pel-4.]--mo-nop'o-lism n. --mo-nop'o-list n. --mo-nop'o-lis'tic adj. --mo-nop'o-lis'ti-cal-ly adv.*

How is gasoline a monopoly? There are special circumstances, but not much different from milk or other commodities considered crucial to the economy.

---------------------------------------------------------

*Excerpted from American Heritage Talking Dictionary

Copyright © 1997 The Learning Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved.

[JSKY]

I have a good example of a monopoly. As long as I can remember. (were talking 35+ years). In my area, we had S.D. cable. (tv only). That was it. No other competition.

They controlled it all. They would raise their price when they felt like it. If you were late by a week in your payment they cut you off. Then you had to pay a reconnect fee.

I one time paid my bill on the final day it was due....and three days later they were up on the pole shutting me off. I went over with the paid bill and told them it was paid and on time. He said I have my orders and shut me off. Called and complained. They said, and this is quote....there's nothing we can do about it...If you want reconnected, you'll have to pay the reconnect fee.

Then three years ago. A company started out called FiberCom. They laid thousands of miles of fiber optic cable and connected 10 different towns together offering Telephone, Cable, And HS Internet. (telephone co. had a monopoly also).

Well over 80% of the people changed. S.D.Cable had to sell out to a Different Co. who expanded across the state. The same with the phone co. Now they keep sending all these special offers if you'll switch back to them. They then combined into similar companies offering packages for the three. And will go out of their way to treat a person like their human. (tho I still run with fiber com, and get great deals because I called and requested their service before they even turned on the first switch).

So yes. The monopolies do control who, what, where and when, and when they want to.

They don't care.

And what are you going to do??? Walk???

[JDoors]

I have a good example of a monopoly. As long as I can remember. (were talking 35+ years). In my area, we had S.D. cable. (tv only). That was it. No other competition. ...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Umm ... Ok. I mean, I get what you're saying, but how that relates to hundreds of gas stations within a 50 mile radius of every major city on the planet I'm not sure.

Cable companies were given a monopoly (see definition #2) due to the expense of laying the infrastructure all the way to individual homes. Now that it's all in place (plus some other considerations) there's some competition allowed. Not to mention options like satellite TV.

[JSKY]

All the stations around here have become BP stations. Becoming a big monopoly. Used to be you could go from one town to another and find a few cent variance. But not anymore. They are all the same price.

Might have to dig up that plutonium I have burried under my house and see if I can get my outfit to run off of it. Should still be good for another 100000 years. or a couple of billion miles.

[robroy]

We still have some competion around here, price dropped ten cents yesterday, now $2.76 / gallon. Glan I,m diving a car with a little 1.8 liter engine unlike the old Buick Centurion that had a 454 4barrel I was lucky to get 10 miles per gallon around town with it.